SmartHomeUSA.com Home Automation

[gwakeen]

Have been in home 4 years, it is about 10 years old and prewired for a security system. Anyone that has done this or knows about it can probably give me some hints, thank you!

I found the front door wires and switch, open the door and the switch does make. It is the windows that I can't figure out.

Each window has two wires going to what I think is a magnetically activated reed switch (abouty 3/8" and installed flush on the side that does not move). The moving side of the window does not have a magnet or corresponding device installed, I assume it would be a magnet that closes (or opens) the reed switch when the window is closed. I have to buy those magnets separately and check out the system before buying the panel.

Questions:
1. Are these switches usually normally open or normally closed. That is will I measure continuity between pairs without a magnet at each window?
2. Are they usually wired (in series) to more than one window (it appears that way).
3. How does a professional installer check this out to be sure all the wiring and switches (multiple switches for more than one window) are intact before hooking it up to a central panel (which I haven't picked out yet).
4. What sort of magnet can I use. Do these switches respond only to a properly matched magnet or will any magnet (strong or weak) trigger them. How do you manage to energize several windows at once and find the proper wires for that set of windows (there is a buncle of wires all brought to one point in the basement).
5. The first floor looks like it was wired (and wires dropped into the basement) but is it usual to NOT wire the second story?

Well you get the idea. Mostly, in the basement where there are only four windows, I would like to find out how to check out the wires and switches.
Electricians often use these sound devices to tag wires, not sure that would work here but perhaps someone has a suggestion.

Once I get the basic layout figured out I can plan and buy a panel, from then on it will be interesting to hook it up and progress. Right now it is confusing because I don't know how they wired the home.

Any help is certainly appreciated.
best, gwakeen

[canon5218]

Q1. Are these switches usually normally open or normally closed. That is will I measure continuity between pairs without a magnet at each window?

A1.Door and Window switches are 90% of the time Normally Closesd, this is the condition with the door or window closed (with magnet installed). Most Security Panels require a End Of Line Resistor that will be in Series with one leg of the zone wire.

Q2. Are they usually wired (in series) to more than one window (it appears that way).

A2. It is possible that they are wired in series. Although me personally I only series devices that are in the same general area.

Q3. How does a professional installer check this out to be sure all the wiring and switches (multiple switches for more than one window) are intact before hooking it up to a central panel (which I haven't picked out yet).

A3 The way I do this is with two people, a 2 way radio, a multimeter on the continuity/audible setting. Put your meter across the leads of one zone wire and have a friend open and close each door and window one at a time while communicating with you on the radios. Something else you will need to find out is the last door or window on the zone wire, you will need to series a resistor on the last device.


Q4. What sort of magnet can I use. Do these switches respond only to a properly matched magnet or will any magnet (strong or weak) trigger them. How do you manage to energize several windows at once and find the proper wires for that set of windows (there is a buncle of wires all brought to one point in the basement).

A4 Most conacts use a decently strong magnet, they do not have to be a special magnet but it is suggested you use a magnet that is made for this application for easibility of mounting. Check out this: http://www.smarthomeusa.com/Shop/Security/Universal-Security-Sensors/Item/944T/ I use the same sensor at work all the time...very nice switch for a good price.

Q5. The first floor looks like it was wired (and wires dropped into the basement) but is it usual to NOT wire the second story?

A5 Yes it is usual noto wire the second floor. There is not alot of thiefs that carry extension ladders around with them. Something you can do for self assurance is put a motion detector at the top of the steps. They can't steal anything of any size with out taking it down the steps.

If you have any further questions feel free to ask. I plan on being a regular around here.

[gwakeen]

Thanks for quick reply. Will comment below in line.


canon5218 wrote: Q1. Are these switches usually normally open or normally closed. That is will I measure continuity between pairs without a magnet at each window?

A1.Door and Window switches are 90% of the time Normally Closesd, this is the condition with the door or window closed (with magnet installed). Most Security Panels require a End Of Line Resistor that will be in Series with one leg of the zone wire.

I need a bunch of magnets which I should install I guess, before going further. It didn't work well to try to place individual magnets around while I measured at the panel end.


Q2. Are they usually wired (in series) to more than one window (it appears that way).

A2. It is possible that they are wired in series. Although me personally I only series devices that are in the same general area.

There are only four brown twisted pair and four white plus a few other wires going to boxes in the wall I assume. One of the brown pairs is the front door. There are three other doors on first floor, looks like they missed the basement door (which is a double door). So the four white pairs I am guessing are for the 14 windows, probably 16 if I count the kitchen swing out windows. So assuming the four white pairs are the wiindows they probably wired in series the basement, the front of first floor, the back of the first floor and the kitchen on the last pair. Just guessing. Will have to get back to this project, buy magnets put them all in and maybe will then have a chance at figuring out what was done.





Q3. How does a professional installer check this out to be sure all the wiring and switches (multiple switches for more than one window) are intact before hooking it up to a central panel (which I haven't picked out yet).

A3 The way I do this is with two people, a 2 way radio, a multimeter on the continuity/audible setting. Put your meter across the leads of one zone wire and have a friend open and close each door and window one at a time while communicating with you on the radios. Something else you will need to find out is the last door or window on the zone wire, you will need to series a resistor on the last device.

You mentioned the series resistor before. I haven't picked out a panel yet, I suppose that would be specified in the panel instructions.


Q4. What sort of magnet can I use. Do these switches respond only to a properly matched magnet or will any magnet (strong or weak) trigger them. How do you manage to energize several windows at once and find the proper wires for that set of windows (there is a buncle of wires all brought to one point in the basement).

A4 Most conacts use a decently strong magnet, they do not have to be a special magnet but it is suggested you use a magnet that is made for this application for easibility of mounting. Check out this: http://www.smarthomeusa.com/Shop/Security/Universal-Security-Sensors/Item/944T/ I use the same sensor at work all the time...very nice switch for a good price.

I need about two dozen of just the magnets. That is what stalled me last time I started on this project. I didn't know which magnet to buy and didn't want to install them all and find they wouldn't work.





Q5. The first floor looks like it was wired (and wires dropped into the basement) but is it usual to NOT wire the second story?

A5 Yes it is usual noto wire the second floor. There is not alot of thiefs that carry extension ladders around with them. Something you can do for self assurance is put a motion detector at the top of the steps. They can't steal anything of any size with out taking it down the steps.

If you have any further questions feel free to ask. I plan on being a regular around here.

Thank you much again. I have to get with this again, once I know the wiring and switches are intact and working I can pick out a system.

[Ralph]

I will re-read your questions monday morning, however I think Canon5218 has done an amazing job on your questions.


Here's a link to replacement magnets for standard door and window mounts, is it what you were looking for?
http://www.smarthomeusa.com/Shop/Security/Universal-Security-Sensors/Item/945-M/

[canon5218]

First off thanks Ralph for your remarks on my answers. I plan on being a regular to this forum, I have been looking for a forum like this for some time now, somewhere that I can spread some knowledge to the do it yourselfers out there.

I beleive gwakeen is needing additional 3/8" flush magnets from his comment "Each window has two wires going to what I think is a magnetically activated reed switch (abouty 3/8" and installed flush on the side that does not move)."

This was my reasoning behind suggesting these http://www.smarthomeusa.com/Shop/Security/Universal-Security-Sensors/Item/944T/

[gwakeen]

Ralph wrote: I will re-read your questions monday morning, however I think Canon5218 has done an amazing job on your questions.


Here's a link to replacement magnets for standard door and window mounts, is it what you were looking for?
http://www.smarthomeusa.com/Shop/Security/Universal-Security-Sensors/Item/945-M/

YES, I agree, never expected such a quick and detailed reply, thanks again Canon.

I will need several dozen magnets, the switches are already in. The magnets would be the 3/8" cylinders that are "press in" units, about an inch long and housed in plastic, white. Several swing out windows may need shorter magnets than the regular windows where I can drill a full inch or so into the bottom. Some of the doors are metal, I don't think that will matter but I wonder about the metal door disturbing the magnetic field. ??? I still have to do some work finding the zones in the house. Thanks for the reply.

[canon5218]

gwakeen: Once you are ready to purchase a panel there is a few things to consider.

1) How many zones do you need for your current coverage?
2) Do you think you may want to add coverage in the future? If so be sure to get a panel that can handle to expansion.
3) Do you have any X-10 automation in your home? If so I suggest the Ademco Vista 20 burglar alarm panel. It has ability to do X-10 controls.
4) Will you be subscribing to a monitoring service, or local alarm only? If you will be doing local alarm only I highly suggest doing an external siren such as this one: http://www.smarthomeusa.com/Shop/Security/honeywell/Honeywell-Modules-Acc/Item/PR-DS406-STK/
If you plan on doing a monitoring plan be sure to check with the service you choose for what type of signal they can recieve. Like us (ADT) we recieve Contact ID.[/b]

[gwakeen]

Hello Travis,
Yes, the switch link you showed me was good, except I hate to pay $3.95 for dozens of switches and only use the magnets. I have a few catalogs around, some of which will sell just the magnets. I will look farther into this when I get a chance, thanks again for the info.
Gwakeen



canon5218 wrote: First off thanks Ralph for your remarks on my answers. I plan on being a regular to this forum, I have been looking for a forum like this for some time now, somewhere that I can spread some knowledge to the do it yourselfers out there.

I beleive gwakeen is needing additional 3/8" flush magnets from his comment "Each window has two wires going to what I think is a magnetically activated reed switch (abouty 3/8" and installed flush on the side that does not move)."

This was my reasoning behind suggesting these http://www.smarthomeusa.com/Shop/Security/Universal-Security-Sensors/Item/944T/

[canon5218]

"metal door disturbing the magnetic field."

No worry there, I install magnets in steal doors all the time with out problem. This is why it is important to use to correct type of magnet for security because they are insulated on the sides to prevent these issues. Check out these: http://www.smarthomeusa.com/Shop/Security/Universal-Security-Sensors/Item/944T/

Maybe Ralph can get you a deal on quantity of the magnets only.

[gwakeen]

HI again,
We must be on line together with messages passing.
I will have to look into the automation ideas, don't know about that at all at this time. I would avoid a monitoring service because of the cost, the external alarm should do OK in this development especially. Main concern is the basement area which is out of sight. There is a wire in to cover a motion detector aimed at the stairway...apparently the company that installed it is up on this, as you certainly are. Thanks again.
Gwakeen



canon5218 wrote: gwakeen: Once you are ready to purchase a panel there is a few things to consider.

1) How many zones do you need for your current coverage?
2) Do you think you may want to add coverage in the future? If so be sure to get a panel that can handle to expansion.
3) Do you have any X-10 automation in your home? If so I suggest the Ademco Vista 20 burglar alarm panel. It has ability to do X-10 controls.
4) Will you be subscribing to a monitoring service, or local alarm only? If you will be doing local alarm only I highly suggest doing an external siren such as this one: http://www.smarthomeusa.com/Shop/Security/honeywell/Honeywell-Modules-Acc/Item/PR-DS406-STK/
If you plan on doing a monitoring plan be sure to check with the service you choose for what type of signal they can recieve. Like us (ADT) we recieve Contact ID.[/b]

[gwakeen]

Great, I will have to get active on this project again, look at the windows that are different and find the rest of the doors which are probably wired one to a pair. Will see.
Thanks again for quick response.
Will be signing off now.
Best, Gwakeen



canon5218 wrote: "metal door disturbing the magnetic field."

No worry there, I install magnets in steal doors all the time with out problem. This is why it is important to use to correct type of magnet for security because they are insulated on the sides to prevent these issues. Check out these: http://www.smarthomeusa.com/Shop/Security/Universal-Security-Sensors/Item/944T/

Maybe Ralph can get you a deal on quantity of the magnets only.

[Ralph]

Although they are not listed on the website, the item you are looking for is the 944wh-m (the wh stands for white). The item price is 2.25 and if you order before Christmas you can use this 10% discount code [S010106A].

Give our sales staff a call at 1-888-843-9103 and tell the saleperson the item number and give them that discount code.